Integration and a multicultural Britain sounds to some people like an oxymoron, but it is not according to Tony Blair. On the contrary, the Prime Minister believes one can't work without the other. While people of different faiths may indeed have the RIGHT to practice their religion, they also have a DUTY to integrate into British society, sharing the values of our society.

Fresh, if that is the word, from the redeye overnight flight from Washington (though unlike us mere mortals, Prime Ministers have onboard beds so tend to get a decent kip), Tony Blair gave a speech at 10 Downing Street this morning to the Runnymede Trust, the educational charity whose aim is to promote a successful multi-ethnic Britain. He tried to define what our British shared values are, beyond our famous tolerance and respect for the law in a liberal democracy.

He asserted that "the shared boundaries of British society within which we are all obliged to live" are vital "precisely in order to preserve our right to our own different faiths, races and creeds."

He sees in Britain "a country at ease with different races, religions and cultures" with "the most comprehensive panoply of anti-discrimination legislation in the world." But international and homegrown terrorism, and in particular the 7/7 bombings in London, has created " for the first time in a generation an anxiety, even at points a resentment that our very openness our willingness to welcome difference, our pride in being home to many cultures, is being used against us; abused, indeed, to harm us."

Mr Blair says that while most Muslims in Britain are thoroughly decent, law-abiding citizens, there is "a new and virulent form of ideology associated with a minority of our Muslim community."

And here's the nub: "The right to be in a multicultural society was always, always implicitly balanced by a duty to integrate, to be part of Britain, to be British and Asian, British and black, British and white." And, clearly, British and Jewish, Hindu, Sikh, whatever.

As for "defining our common values", Mr Blair offers this: "Obedience to the rule of law, to democratic decision-making about who governs us, to freedom from violence and discrimination are not optional for British citizens. They are what being British is all about."

Mr Blair points to six practical measures to underscore the duty to integrate: Ensuring grants to community groups are used to promote integration as well as distinctive cultural identity; equality of respect and treatment for all British citizens (and he says that means no forced marriages); allegiance to the rule of law; a crackdown on visiting preachers from abroad; citizenship as part of the National Curriculum since 2002; and a common language,i.e. English tests for would-be permanent residents.

He calls for inter-faith dialogue and collective leadership from leaders of the main religious and racial groups, and he finished his speech with this: "Our tolerance is part of what makes Britain Britain. So conform to it, or don't come here. We don't want the hate-mongers, whatever their race, religion or creed.... The right to be different. The duty to integrate. That is what being British means. And neither racists nor extremists should be allowed to destroy it."

This is a sensitive and controversial issue, and Tony Blair's is simply the latest contribution to the ongoing debate. But it is clear that he believes the traditional British values of tolerance and decency are being sorely tested.

(Post by Sky News Political Correspondent, Glen Oglaza)

Comments

[BlairSupporter 16 Dec 2006 11:56:00]

To Maurice & Bruce,

I'm not quite with you there. What exactly did I say contradicting your figures? I gave no figures and no argument against immigration. My point was that it is not the fault of this Prime Minister that we have immigrants. That's all. Fairly obvious, since immigration is natural and normally to be encouraged when it's done in a balanced and sensible way as in most developed countries.

Thanks to Paul btw, for your figures. Interesting. One thought comes to mind:

Talk about punching above your weight.

[Effie 16 Dec 2006 11:07:39]

Paul London:

You will send Maurice into a flat spin with those remarks. His PC Mouse will be working overtime to try and contradict those figures. Having said that, those are just figures for citizens here legally. By the very nature of the word illegal nobody really knows the exact number of illegals here.

Every Country around the globe faces the same problems. It is not something just peculiar to the UK. Then People ask why we should have Identity Cards? They would hopefully register and coupled with CCTV, help to keep a track of everybody coming in and out of this Country. Especially those who are here from abroad legally but are well known for preaching hate. CCTV's along with ID documentation can help to identify those showing an unhealthy interest in their preaching.

[Bill, Middle England 15 Dec 2006 21:26:31]

The UK is now run for the benefit of the 4% minority.

There is a growing concentration of minorities in areas dotted about the country, and these are creating ever-increasing regions within the UK wishing to lead a non-UK lifestyle.

A political timebomb is ticking and it's time for mainstream parties to look after the 96% majority.

[Bruce Hulmes / England 15 Dec 2006 18:48:02]

The immigrant population grew by 53% between the years 1991/ 2001.
That is not including asylum seekers and illegal immigrants, figures for the latter who knows? Between 500'000 & 1 million? We have a government that controls everything but our boarders - WHY? Only 70% of the population of England and Wales consider themselves white Christians!!

Some Lord HAW HAW is now suggesting schools teach Polish, Punjabi, Arabic etc, still the liberals will not except that multiculturism is not only dead, but never lived except in the minds of the pro-immigrant lobby.

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 15 Dec 2006 17:46:46]

Why Paul did you make no reference to the Birth rate Ratio Ethnic - White?

Infact why did you not just give ALL the information:-
In 2005, an estimated 185,000 more people entered than left the UK for at least a year. This net in-migration was lower than the 2004 estimate, but was higher than the estimates for all other years since the method to estimate Total International Migration began in 1991.

The estimated outflow from the UK of 380,000 sustained the high level of out-migration seen in recent years. This was equivalent, on average, to over 1,000 people a day leaving the UK to live abroad, over half of whom were British citizens.

Although slightly lower than the 2004 estimate, the number of people arriving to live in the UK remained high at 565,000 in 2005, an average of over 1,500 a day.

An estimated 198,000 British citizens migrated from the UK in 2005. Once again Australia was the most preferred destination for British citizens migrating abroad, followed by Spain and France.

Overall, an estimated 64,000 more A8 citizens migrated into the UK for at least a year than left in 2005, compared with 49,000 in 2004.

Long-term outflows of A8 citizens also increased notably for the first time in 2005 but trends in migration outflows will not become clear until future years. Almost 80 per cent of this outflow occurred in the second half of 2005.

And why is Gross Immigration not an issue? It is after all probably the number one reason for the mass exodus of Brits!

[SHAN 15 Dec 2006 17:16:08]

Paul from London,

If you read my previous posts you would know that my fingers have started to ache from the amount of times I have stated"THERE ARE CRIMINALS IN EVERY COMMUNITY AND WE SHOULD NOT SINGLE OUT THE RELIGIOUS AFFILIATION OF ONE GROUP ONLY".

Some people have a very bad fixation with Muslim women and say they do not have rights etc. The odd thing is a report has just been released in India which states that in the last 20 years 10 million girls have been aborted or killed after birth.

Currently nearly 7000 girls are aborted or killed every week in India, yet I have not heard the leaders of Britain and America demonising and calling these people evil.

Is this a mere oversight from the people who go on lecturing Muslims about womens rights? Or does this information not fit in with their goal of vilifying Muslims and creating a atmosphere of hatred and distrust?

[Bruce Hulmes / England 15 Dec 2006 17:15:44]

If Islam is a fair religion why can men have several wives, but women only one husband?

So a muslim marries his first wife, then fancies another women and another are these additional women not an act of adultery on the previous wife?

Just a thought!!

[Paul, London 15 Dec 2006 13:28:29]

THE IMMIGRATION MYTH

As per 2001 Census
Total UK Pop @ 2001 = 58,789,194
Whites = 54,153,898
Indians = 1,053,411
Pakistani's = 747,285
Bangla Deshi's = 283,063
Other Asian = 247,664
Carrb/Blacks = 1,148,738
Chinese = 247,043
Other Ethnics' = 230,615

Total Ethnics = 4,635,296
% of Total Pop 7.9%

Percentages of Total Population @ 2001 census
Whites 92.1%

NET IMMIGRATION SINCE 2001
Net Imm 02-04 = 528,000>0.9%>TP
IND/BD/SL = 121,000> 22.92%
Pakistani's = 40,000> 7.58%
Carrb/Blacks = 119,000> 22.54%
EU 15 old =( 39,000)>-7.39%
AUS/NZ/CAN =( 77,000)>-14.6%
S.Africa = 58,000> 10.98%
USA =( 7,000)>-1.33%
M.EAST = 54,000 >10.23%
REST inc new EU = 259,000 >49.05%
Net Imm 2005 = 185,000

Tot Growth> Im'gt Pop by Immigration only (exc Births)fm 2001 eg.Pak was 747285,is 787285

So the indigenous white people can breathe a sigh of relief, the non whites are still a drop in the ocean, I wonder who pressed the panic button?! But joking aside, as I said before we need to get a tighter grip on future migration into UK.

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 15 Dec 2006 10:30:02]

Dare i mention that currently in Pakistan, a Muslim women has to produce four independant witnesses to testify that she was actually raped and in the absence of those four witnesses she is automatically assumed to have committed adultery!!

The Pakistan government are quite rightly attempting to change this law in the face of tremedous opposition and violent street protests, organised by radical islamic groups in that country..

[Paul, London 15 Dec 2006 09:19:08]

Posted by: Andrew, Reddich 14 Dec 2006 15:17:08

REPLY: Shan is just trying to defend the undefendable, and therein lies the problem with some Muslims, they can’t take constructive criticism. Instead they come out with some of the most obvious arguments in defence. Instead of accepting the truth that there are bad Muslims too ((like any other community), and condemning the wrong they inadvertently end up defending the guilty ones.

When people feel angry with themselves for the actions of their kin folk in letting them down, this is generally the case. They feel that their whole ‘religion’ is under scrutiny, and this is particularly applicable to people of Islamic faith, because ‘tolerance’ is not one of its strong traits.

The other major weakness within the makeup of some Muslims is that they may not develop as free thinkers, and apply their own judgement to any given situation. To them Islam is the thought and Mohammed did the thinking for them; they live and breathe Islam, thus limiting them in being progressive i.e. outward looking. Although there are some extremely progressive Muslims who are gagged by the minority of loud mouth religious leaders with a huge following. Their unfounded fear is that things will get out of control and their own positions within the community will be untenable, so the stick is used in the form of ‘Fatwa’ and religious bigotry.

On the issue of statistics; my belief is that crime is never a good topic to discuss at any time due to it being entrenched in pain and sorrow of victims, and particularly violent rape, regardless of its perpetrators. The particular difficulty with rape is that it is an extremely sensitive issue at the best of times, and to try and define it in terms of ‘race’ is highly explosive as a social issue.

It is also very difficult to prove intent in majority of the cases, unless there is a systematic gang rape of someone and its premeditated status then becomes obvious. The authorities fear reprisals to be the order of the day if one starts brandishing statistics around, as often this arouses the most violent of emotions to seek revenge, even in the most placid people.

In my extreme opinion where guilt is 110% proven, then the perpetrators should be emasculated and publicly shamed. I believe that if the punishment for crime was extreme then people would think twice before committing it. Ironically, some of the Islamic countries like Saudi Arabia have some of the most extreme laws for even things like theft that keeps the country free of criminals most of the times.

But the issue between civilised societies and extreme ones is who is right and who is wrong? There are those in civilised societies who seek the root causes for such crimes and the underlying circumstances, and the extreme ones just do away with such niceties and take extreme measures like ‘capital punishment’. But what is someone is innocent?

The whole Criminal Justice System depends upon the honesty and integrity of the Judiciary, the Police and people. The problem with Crime and statistics is that the moment one deviates from the notion of crime and criminals as a objective issues and leans towards the subjective.

[Andrew, Reddich 14 Dec 2006 15:17:08]

Paul,

I agree with your comments on Muslim men who seem to think it is ok for them to be promiscuous but not for their womenfolk, just look at the current discussions on rape laws in Pakistan. Muslims seem to think all western women are no better than prostitutes. Shan illustrates perfectly, muslim attitudes to western sexual habits by comparing us to Soddom and Gommorah in the old testament (a story later to be highjacked by Islam). Perhaps he wishes us to be destroyed by "fire and brimstone".

Recently a Tory MP was criticised (branded racist) for commenting that most muggings were carried out by black men. While I have no comment to make on that particular issue I do believe there should be more transparency with crime figures. We should know the facts. On the subject of crime figures I would like to know what percentage of rapes carried out by Muslim men were against white women? And, as I agree that rape is a violent rather than a sexual crime, why none of these rapes are treated as racist?

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 14 Dec 2006 12:13:41]

Blair Supporter - where do you get your information from? Tony, No.10 or Labour HQ perhaps.
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=260
It shows a graph that totally contradicts your statement on recent Immigration.

[Bruce Hulmes / England 13 Dec 2006 17:58:58]

Blair supporter.

No Blair did not start bring in the immigrants that was a previous Labour Party in 1948.

Blair as increased immigration to levels never seen in this country before. These levels are unsustainable both from an economical and cultural prospective.

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 13 Dec 2006 16:48:03]

For any Blair Supporter:-
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=260
So - it would seem that neither a Blair supporter nor Blair nor Labour can claim to be very sharp in any pack! Other than the pack of the mediocre! Truth is not a strong hand dealt from the pack either!

[Liz, Germany 13 Dec 2006 13:03:24]

I live and work in Germany for many years and I have integrated in the local community well because I have bothered to learn the language of the country I live in and have acknowledged the German culture. As much as I agree with most of the comments in this blog that other cultures should make the effort in integrating in the community whilst living in Great Britain ie learning the English language; how many British people whilst either on holiday or living abroad actually bother to learn the language of the country they are visiting or residing in?

Since I have lived in Germany and knowing of others who live in Spain, I know of so many expats who either haven't bothered or won't integrate in the communities of the countries they live in. I often receive comments from the German people over here who are amazed that someone who is British can actually speak a second language.

[anon 13 Dec 2006 11:17:24]

I think that anyone wishing to live here must learn English to be able to integrate,so much is spent on translators for people, in order for them a lot of the time to claim benefits, and for hospital treatment.

I lived for a time in Portugal, I tried and succeeded in the main to speak enough Portuguese to be able to communicate with the hospital etc and would not have expected to have had a translator, after all I had chosen to live in their country. Why on earth do we spend so much on translators? These people live for years here and don't learn English; how can they be expected to integrate?

[M. Pironi 13 Dec 2006 08:31:48]

I have lived abroad for many years in many countries and have always respected my host country and its laws regardless of personal views. The same should apply to vistors in the UK (let's not forget it’s a minority who flaunt the system)

Simple rule: SHAPE UP OR SHIP OUT!

(This applies to all the benefit fraudsters as well)

[Bill, Middle England 13 Dec 2006 08:21:21]

Comments on this blog highlight the simple truth that other cultures simply do not wish to integrate as it against their beliefs. Separatist bodies riddle our country and serve to encourage resentment and prejudice. The CRE is a prime example.

The only way a multicultural society can live in harmony is for all sections to respect and abide by one set of common principles. By definition, this is impossible.

Multiculturalism is trumpetted by the trendy PC set as a sign of a superior naion. What naive nonsense. Under this Government, Britain has become a haven for foreign nationals and self-interest groups seeking special treatment at the expense of the British taxpayer.

Until our society votes in a Government which believes in applying equal standards to all citizens, we will continue to be sitting on a political powder keg.

[Merv. Beszant, Dubai 13 Dec 2006 06:02:44]

SHAN,

I can accept, as general comments, what you say about we Brits abroad, but what you failed to mention, and it is very relevant to this blog, is the fact that we do not affect other people's lives with our religious beliefs, as basically, we, as a nation, have very sensibly moved away from religion.

Your opening paragraph is misguided, as it is the people living in the U.K. who are affected by, and complaining about, the immigration problem, and we expats are merely commenting.

Finally, if the blood carries diseases, as you state, how come the whole animal isn't diseased?

[Merv. Beszant, Dubai 13 Dec 2006 03:08:42]

T.M.P.S.L,

Difficult decision for a Southern Softy who played Union, but I suppose it has to be Wigan!

[BlairSupporter 13 Dec 2006 01:20:39]

Tony Blair didn't start the flow of incomers, which we now call "multiculturalism". So the hate-mongers can get off his back right now. Oh, and find somewhere else to live, whatever creed, colour, religion you are if this country, in all its breadth and richness, is so bad.

From the 1950s on colonial immigration was encouraged by Conservative governments too and was considered both "our duty" (as they were from our colonies), and "useful" to expand the workforce after the war.

I can't say that I have ever been fond of the term, but I can understand why it was used. Imagine calling it "separate-culturalism" or "non-integration". Not quite the welcome message that immigrants should receive. Perhaps the aspiration was higher than the reality would permit. But you should remember that although south London is one third non-caucasian and Birmingham is almost 50/50 (it seems), there are still many parts of the country where the native is almost 100%. I live in such an area.

Our Prime Minister is the sharpest card in the political pack and realises what is going on in some parts of the country. So, what is he supposed to do when the results of a 50 year open-door immigration policy are turning sour in some quarters? Say nothing? That would resolve nothing.

It is not HIS responsibility to ensure that the Labour party wins the next election. In fact he could be forgiven for ignoring many issues right now. As it is, he lays them on the table lmost daily. He takes the heat if they are not popular, and his party, without him, will reap the benefits.

Remember there are no Left and Right in politics any more. Just progressives. This is largely due to the towering leadership of Tony Blair, who has repositioned his own party and thus the opposition. He makes the rest of our leadership candidates right across the board, look like political pygmies.

At least now the incomers should think, as should the rest of us, about how we interact, and if we don't, why not? Certainly sharia law should have no place in our land. Full veils should only be worn where they do not upset the natives in the same way as a western woman in a Muslim land would not wear a bikini or revealing dress in public.

[Bruce Hulmes / England 12 Dec 2006 22:35:04]

Another story from Blair's multicultural paradise. BBC news this evening the NHS spends £55 MILLION on translators and having imformation printed into foreign languages. This is the same NHS that is closing A&E units and laying off nursing staff, due to a lack of money. Theres plenty in the pot for immigrants Overall, taking into account the council, police etc the bill comes to over £100million for translating enough is enough.

It is about time this criminal government came clean with the true figures on what immigration is costing we British.

[Paul - London 12 Dec 2006 16:56:53]

Posted by: SHAN--Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 15:35:06
REPLY
The Difference is that your method is long and drawn where the animal suffers a slow and torturous death, not a quick and humane death, in any case you conveniently left the rest of my questions out, haven't you got anything to say about the most pertinent and relevant abuses?

Look up the dictionary for the meaning, and don't lecture me on loose morals, some muslims are up to their eyeballs in anything loose morals just that they hide it even from themselves, and haven't the courage to own up. I was at a XMAS party on Sunday, and there they were drinking, smoking, latching after women (difference was that they weren't Muslim girls, they had conveniently left their spouses home) so it makes it OK, and as it was done in the name of Christianity does it make it right? I even have photographic evidence to that affect.

You never had any answer to the previous acts of Islamic Morality that I put to you on the not so Syrian Track, below;

"They are still at it all over the world, they are involved in forcefully converting Hindu, Sikh and Christian school and college girls making them do shameful acts and videoing it and then blackmailing them to get their sisters and friends, or else they would go public with the material, this happens even in this country. So the Muslims shouldn’t accuse others of such demonic activities when they are the leaders in this field."

Can you say it openly that Muslims will renounce Violence?

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 12 Dec 2006 16:17:34]

Torture is part of Islamic Culture, human or otherwise, throat cutting (smite) being a major element, so animals have not a chance in hell!

[SHAN--Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 15:35:06]

Paul,

Before you get on your high horse and start talking about torture, remember one thing; if you are going to talk about a matter in emotive terms them every living organism that is utilised by humans can be emotively spoken about. What makes you or anyone else think that plants do not feel pain? What makes you think that by stunning, shooting or wringing chickens necks you are not a torturer? Anyone who eats plants or animals can be considered a torturer at one level or another.

I do not know hat you mean by progressive, but by having a society with loose morals and sexual promiscuity if you call that progress I am sorry to say that is not progress but transgression back to the days of soddom and gommoroh.

[Paul, London 12 Dec 2006 14:45:45]

Posted by: SHAN--Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 13:12:21

REPLY: The notion of killing an animal for food OK, but how does it make it OK to torture it? Your method of allowing the animal to bleed to death is barbaric and inhumane to say the least.

On the one hand your religion allows this barbaric act and then says that by cleansing the body of blood it makes it safe for consumption, but what about cleansing one’s soul of committing atrocities against other human beings? How does that make it safe for society, does this not stink of hypocrisy? Isn’t spilling the blood of innocent people forbidden in Islam?

The problem with Islam is that it is not a progressive religion, it doesn’t evolve with time, hence the charge that it belongs to the dark ages. Most religions were conceived while man was an infantile, but now he is fully matured and at the peak of his mental development stage, and yet the Muslims don’t see that, and just eradicate all bad practices from within Islam. I am not advocating that you ditch any salient practices (sense of community) but the non-relevant barbaric ones and come join the rest in the 21st Century. Can your people do that or are they hell bent in living in the past?

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 12 Dec 2006 13:39:10]

SHAN -

1 - name a Western country where Muslims are in significant numbers, and there are no problems?

2 - how can one identify a none-moderate Muslim?

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 12 Dec 2006 13:34:25]

SHAN

I hate to be negative but.. why would God determine how a beast is to be slaughtered?

[SHAN--Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 13:12:21]

Rich you proved my point that people living outside of the U.K are the ones who tend to hold negative views about immigration even though they maybe immigrants themselves. If I give an opinion it is attack, but when you do the same it is a innocent remark or opinion held by you. The word is double standards or in common terms hypocrisy.

By slaughtering the animal, the body is cleansed of blood which carries diseases and therefore is better for human consumption, as blood is forbidden to be used for human consumption.

People in Europe who were British people have settled in large numbers, and people tend to have the same stereotypical views about British people, as do some posters about immigrants to Britain. They stick to their own, they do not learn the language, they eat their own food and make no effort to integrate into the community, it seems people with biased and prejudicial views exist everywhere.

[simon, crewe 12 Dec 2006 13:04:19]

Surely in the modern world people cannot seriously think the manner in which an animal is killed makes any difference to the food they eat. Is it not the same as saying it makes a different that the animal was shot with a bolt rather than a bullet?

Perhaps someone could explain the need for this practice to us all and it would help remove one small barrier towards a truely multicultural society.

We have introduced regulation with regard to the humane treatment of animals produced for the purpose of slaughter, with regard to their transportation and the manner in which the are kept and killed, yet because this is a Muslim tradition, it some how overides the law of the land. Multi-standard not multicultural I would say!

[Paul, London 12 Dec 2006 12:51:55]

Posted by: Andrew , Reddich 11 Dec 2006 19:46:59

REPLY:

I think you are putting the cart before the horse here, the BNP must develop relevant Manifesto and policies first to be called ‘an All Inclusive Party’ and I am quite happy to assist them in that process. And as far as Tony Blair is concerned, he did exactly that, he amended his erroneous policies and put forward the right agenda for people to elect him and the Labour Party. And yes, people have all the rights to change their focus according to changes in circumstances and I believe the BNP should do the same before the next elections.

You and many others can’t see beyond the one single issue of immigration and are hell bent to destroy all the good work done, I am amazed that you, being a sensible one, can get sucked into all the hype and fear of ignorance. I believe, you didn’t read the reports by the IPPR’s in full to understand the whole issue of ‘immigration’ and ‘emigration’ or else you wouldn’t be persisting on a lame issue. I have already made my views on this issue crystal clear and a lot of people have agreed to them including a lot of BNP members that I know and from the Ethnic minorities.

Thank God you have agreed that at least Blair has confessed, and as even God is meant to forgive those who confess, so are you going to?

We all agree on one thing that the PC Brigade has it’s own agenda, even in the mighty US of A they have had a strangle hold over proceedings, but the climate is changing, and it won’t change overnight, does take some time, but we shouldn’t undo the mostly good things at the expense of a few bad ones, doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.

I don’t endorse the Labour Party, at least you have voted for them, but I haven’t so I maintain an objective view of the whole situation not a subjective one. As you said that the other ones aren’t cohesive parties at present so that leave only the current one by default.

If you compare the 15 years of the Tories reign and their record on the whole, and then look at merely 10 years of this government and if one is honest without any personal axe to grind and without prejudice then they have performed miracles. Yes, Immigration and the Iraq war are two of my own bug bears, but I am not going to pour down the drain the 98% of good work, that would be unwise, as I said not to cut off the nose to spite the face scenario.

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 12 Dec 2006 12:33:35]

Wigan or Wakefield Merv......

[rich new zealand 12 Dec 2006 12:11:25]

Re Shan,

You are havin a laugh telling the world that halal slaughter is the quickest. Don't forget to mention that is also the most painful, barbaric ways to kill a beast! If you must quote do it in full.

As for fox hunting please tell me why it was done in the first place? And please do tell me why it is so important to Muslims to have halal meat (as I honestly don't know)? As someone born and raised in the country and worked in it all my life (both in the UK and in New Zealand) I have spent a lot of my time doing both of the above.

[Peter Chuah, Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 12:10:09]

Shan said, "it has been proven that slaughter (by halal) is the fastest method of death compared to other methods". Can you give first hand accounts or failing that demonstrate it yourself? I am sure one would choose a more rapid death, rather than the slow lingering death by throat slitting.

Apparently the same method of throat slitting is done to harvest Kosher meat (apart from the prayers to the one ‘God’, praise be upon him), according to the teachings passed on by Moses.

[Caz - Yorkshire 12 Dec 2006 12:09:46]

Tony Blair was right in what he said but it is far too little too late. He should realise that it is HIS party who have brought about the many problems we are seeing now!

He should have taken a tougher line with immigration ages ago and as for the human rights laws they're a joke. Bending over backwards for certain groups does not help them in the long run, and breeds resentment in the rest of the community. I totally believe everyone should make the effort to integrate.

If I moved to a different country I would expect to learn the language and learn to fit in with that community, but then again, I would not move to a country that was totally at odds with my beliefs. And I would definately not try to change that community to suit me... as the saying goes when in Rome....

[rich new zealand 12 Dec 2006 11:42:08]

Re. Shan,

Once again you attack bloggers for having opinions on matters within the UK purely on the basis that we are not there; I'm in the same boat as Merv. If I could commute I would! In this global age of communication thanks Sky we can remain in contact as it were 24/. I too have all my family in the UK, so to have an interest on what's happening is only logical.

It seems that during the course of debate, if you feel that you don't like what's said, you regulary attack some one for the vagest of reasons, and to date have never answered any question asked of you without prejudice. I/we don't ask out of fun, I/we ask out of better understanding of the issue in debate.

To attack me as I'm not in the country really is a poor defence!

[SHAN--Birmingham 12 Dec 2006 11:24:37]

Fox hunting is done for pleasure not for food, halal meat is the food people eat. For those who do not know it has been proven that slaughter is the fastest method of death compared to other methods.

Muslim demonstrators have been put in jail for carrying placards with messages that were considered to break the law, it is quite easy to just to say what you feel but there must be objectivity when such matters are commented upon.

If wearing a cross on top of your normal clothing is a religious must, then I would support all those who criticise allowing people of other religions to practice their religious obligations, but if it is not a religious requirement then it is a choice that you make.

[Merv. Beszant, Dubai 12 Dec 2006 10:09:00]

T.M.P.S.L.

Your second paragraph describes my favourite Spanish dish!

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 12 Dec 2006 08:58:01]

Simon

I get your drift but those ex-pats living in Spain (for example) don't necessarily attend Mass, drink vino, eat paella and watch bullfights on Saturday afternoons...

To my certain knowledge they still dine on egg and chips with a large dollop of tomato sauce washed down with warm beer, whilst watching rugby league (Wigan v Wakefield preferably) and keeping an eye out for the results of the 3.30pm at Kempton Park..

Multi culturalism yes, assimilation never. The same goes for those other countries I mentioned....

[DENNIS HERTS 12 Dec 2006 06:21:03]

Fox hunting is banned yet the practise of Halal meat is allowed to continue. Forced marriage is banned yet the Goverment make a U turn over this issue. Crash helmets and hoodies have been banned in many areas (banks ect) but the veil is ok! The cross has been banned but once again the veil, Turbans and Bangels are ok! B.N.P. has been taken to court over on charges, but Muslim demonstrators let off with no action taken.

Multiculturalism for who Mr Blair?

[Merv. Beszant, Dubai 12 Dec 2006 05:50:06]

SHAN,

There is nothing odd about me living in Dubai, as when you work here, daily commuting is out of the question!

I fail to understand why you consider me to be an expert, as my blog merely expresses my views on a particular subject, and I have used the words 'feel'and 'think'.

I am at a complete loss regarding the logic related to your second paragraph, as I have never had a problem fitting in with the communities of all the countries in which I have worked since 1962, and what 'looking back at Britain' is supposed to mean is beyond me!

Obviously my comments have struck a nerve, but as always, they are completely impartial and are not related to any religious beliefs, but I don't think that you would be able to say the same about yours.

We are all entitled to our opinions, but, if you consider that the current situation in the U.K. is not the result of the average Brit's patience having been tried, then I would suggest that you are in the minority.

Regarding your comment related to knowing what is happening in the U.K., I must say that it is not difficult when you have Sky News, visit regularly and have a family who are resident!

[Bruce Hulmes / England 11 Dec 2006 21:12:09]

Why have had mass immigration in the last 50 years? Answer - the welfare state, pure and simple. Two groups support immigration; they are the politicians who opened the door to our country being over run (and a politician will never admit to a mistake), and the immigrants themselves.

They have created this problem themselves with their greed and stupidity. They thought that the gravy train would run and run, it is not only the Muslims who are attempting to over turn our culture, pratically every group sees some little wedge that they can drive in to the doorway. Indians now want open air cremations, they do not have to wear crash helmets if riding a motorcycle, they threatened to cause trouble over a certain play in Birmingham.

Muslims are not the only trouble makers, they are just the most vocal. The rest intended to use stealth but that as been seen for what it is, and now things may be changing. So we can all say what Blair said; any foreigner, either fit in pay your tax, stop scrounging or ship out. The gravy trains started to run out of steam.

[Andrew , Reddich 11 Dec 2006 19:46:59]

Paul,

The BNP may not be an all inclusive party at present, but the more people vote for them, then the more inclusive they will need to become. Why can't a far right party of today become a centre right party of tomorrow? Such shifts in political focus are not uncommon, wasn't Tony Blair a socialist once? Why can't extreme elements of the BNP be driven out in the same way as the "militant tendancy" was driven out of the Labour party?

A protest vote can be a very powerfull tool; in 2002 Jean-Marie Le Pen gave Jacques Chiraq a run for his money in the French presidential elections, this led to a much tougher line being taken against multi-culturalism and immigration in France.

How can you endorse the Labour party as being the only party capable of sorting things out, when it is they who have compounded the problem with their irresponsible immigration policies and PC driven legislation? Blair's speech was good but he is just a "lame duck" prime minister, confessing his sins before he rides off into the sunset, and leaves somebody else to pick up the pieces of this divided country.

My advice to the expats in Spain? Learn Spanish!

[simon, crewe 11 Dec 2006 16:32:06]

Morning Post,

Therefore you are not enoying multiculturalism, you are integrating into that society. The problem we have here is the immigrants that want us to change to help them integrate, therefore we are integrating with them and not vice versa. And why should we?

I would not move to Iran and then expect them to open up a sports bar and show live football 24/7, and of course several late night takeaways just to suit me. That's why I live in Britain.

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 11 Dec 2006 15:58:02]

Simon

We Brits currently enjoy 'multiculturalism' in Spain, Portugal, France, Germany, Cyprus, Malta, Gibralta, Greece, Italy......shall I go on?

It's a choice each one of us makes, where we live and with whom. But having made that choice, we have to fit in and adhere to the cultural environment which we have chosen for ourselves and not try to turn the natives into Brits. Thats the key....

[Paul, London 11 Dec 2006 15:22:56]

Posted by: The Morning Post Sri Lanka 11 Dec 2006 12:25:27

Posted by: The Morning Post Sri Lanka 9 Dec 2006 00:43:08

Well Morning Post, We do agree on something after all, see it isn't hard if one has an open mind, and I am glad to back you on both of the above posts. I have always advocated that sanity should prevail, at the end of the day we are all humans, however those who advocate 'violence' should be banished from Society, no matter who they are.

I further agree with all those who say that it is some of those from the PC Brigade who spoil things, I wonder as to what their real agenda is?

Andrew - Redditch, I have said before, that if the BNP was an all inclusive party, with similar policies that I have listed and you have agreed, then most people wouldn't hesitate in supporting them. A protest vote is fine if it delivers a sound government, however, if a protest vote lands us with either the Liberals or the Tories then I am afraid we will paid dearly. I agree there are a few problems within the Labour Party and they have gone off at a tangent, but with Blair's speech it seems to have woken up.

I have also written to the PM with my list of suggestions and said that he need not worry about the 'Immigrant community' as I am 100% sure that apart from radical Islamists they are all behind tighter immigration controls and a British way of life, but we need to sort out the Status issue first and foremost as a lack of this gives rise to uncertainty and loyalties start to waver, if people were certain that their British Status was not in question, then they could get on and integrate.

There is a report out today about Britons Abroad which demonstrates that being an immigrant isn't the easiest thing and people do miss their roots. The Expats in Spain were finding it difficult to integrate because of the language barrier and none of the people who were leaving Britain left, due to the mass immigration.

There are those busy bodies (EXPERTS) who for their own sorry backsides and prejudices wind the ordinary joes like you and me up into a Frenzy so that their pay packets stay secure. I have always commented on what the ordinary people are feeling out there, most of them are stirred up by what they have read or seen in the Media, so there is a lesson to be learned.

We need to stay focused and not lose sight of the bigger picture, we can get the government on the straight and narrow, by being positive and constructive.

http://www.ippr.org.uk/members/download.asp?f=%2Fecomm%2Ffiles%2FBA%5Fexec%5Fsumm%2Epdf

[simon, crewe 11 Dec 2006 14:21:49]

I do not see the need for multiculturalism at all, the world is a massive place made up of hundreds of countries, each with there own blend of policy/religion so much so that there should be a country somewhere which ideally suits the religious/cultural needs of everyone.

If you want to be a fanatical Muslim then Iran or Sudan may be the place for you, If you want to be a Buddhist move to Tibet, if you like cricket and surfing then why not try Australia.

The point I make is this there is tension on a world scale between these differing countries/ideologies as they have irreconcilable differences which are so polarised they will never be solved. What on earth makes Blair think this will not be played out as microcosm in his multi cultural utopia? Let's face it, it has never ever worked in the past, it just shows the ego of the man to think he can make it work now.

Multiculturalism is in effect a compromise which in the end nobody is happy with.

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 11 Dec 2006 13:23:51]

Shan

So right. Integration should never mean assimilation. I currently live abroad, a Christian with a Muslim wife, living amongst Muslims and Christians alike in total peace and harmony. I received gifts of food at the end of Ramadan and i will distribute gifts during the forthcoming Christmas season to my Muslim neighbours.

This is multi culturalism in action and it should be happening in the UK today, Why isn't it ?

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 11 Dec 2006 13:07:01]

I also remember the Co-Op and the pulley system which acted rather like the old British Rail signalling system.

If two cups were in danger of collision on the network, one would always give way to the other. I am not sure how, maybe someone here could enlighten us?

On the question of good health, good genes are the key. If your parents lived to a ripe old age you probably will too. If not enjoy yourself while you can. Quality of life outweighs quantity any day of the week..

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 11 Dec 2006 12:25:27]

I think it's time for moderate British people of all ethnic backgrounds and religions to stick their heads above the parapet to vocally and unequivically distance themselves from all radical minorities.

Remember that old saying 'The squeakiest wheel gets the most oil' well let all of us moderates squeak louder then the radicals.

Remember that there are so many more of us than there are them...

[Effie 11 Dec 2006 11:56:02]

Gerald Manchester:

Quite a comical piece but true nevertheless. I was brought up during the war on Rations, everybody went to the Local Co-op for the 'Divi', in there lying on the floor was usually sacks of sugar, flour, potatoes etc. waiting to be weighed up and bagged.

On the Marble counter there was always slabs of Margarine, Lard, 'Mouse Trap Cheese' as we called the Cheddar, plus a cat usually sitting beside all of that, licking his/her proverbial (I am not joking either with that statement).

There was no such thing as refrigeration. The ration books were marked and the cash used to be put in cups to take up to the offices via a pulley.
People just never ran in and out constantly washing their hands as we have to do now.

At 68 years old I am as fit as a butcher's dog with the exception of eyesight, I only have 3 of my own teeth missing. What does that tell you of life as it was compared to now? How things have changed; and not always for the better.

[SHAN--Birmingham 11 Dec 2006 11:06:37]

It is rather odd the Merv lives in Dubai but is a expert on what happens in Britain, and feels that the levels of tolerance have been exceeded.
Well Merv, it proves how much you are integrated into the society you live in since it seems you have not integrated into your community but keep looking back at Britain.

It is also rather odd that a lot of people posting about Britain going downhill and other negative remarks themselves are living abroad. If the people of that country were asked their views about these people I am sure they would not be too different from the views held by the posters.

Integration does not mean assimilation and I think a lot of the posters misunderstand the meaning of the two words.

[Merv. Beszant, Dubai 11 Dec 2006 04:30:48]

Peter,

Speaking the same language is essential, but I feel that learning to tolerate, and respect each others different religions and cultures is the best that we can hope for, as these are not going to change. 'Integration' to me implies that we are all supposed to end up as a complete mixture of every religion and culture that exists, which of course is not acceptable.

We must always maintain our British way of life, and everybody, without exception, should abide by the rules and regulations that are in place, in exactly the same way that every other country in the world applies their own associated laws.

We Brits have a reputation for being hypocritical, generally because we are tolerant and don't like upsetting people, but when our patience runs out, we can be as nasty as the next person, and with the current situation in the U.K. I think that our tolerance level has been exceeded.

[gerald manchester 10 Dec 2006 22:38:46]

There was a recent TV programme about 20 couples whose wedding photos appeared in the press 25 years ago. They had produced 24 children between them. That is the answer. The English are dying out because of a multiplicity of causes.

We have two parallel sexes who mimic each other. Women can be divided into the breeders who produce most of the children usually before they are 15. The workers who do all the work.

The sex industry who deal with the problems created by the first two, and create yet more problems of their own.

An Indian friend used to tell me they did not need to argue with us. all they have to do is out produce us. So stopped arguing, and carry on enjoying your binge drinking, foreign holidays, drugs, gadgets, AND KEEP WEARING THOSE TIGHT JEANS. Although I think it is more to do with the cocktail of chemicals we have been bombarded with over the last 50 years.

200 years ago you could send people on a 9 month voyage to Australia living on hard tack, and weevils. They would arrive paired up and ready to fight a harsh drought stricken land, producing a strong new nation.

Now give them every vitamin supplement power drinks, and all the rest, and they would be killing each other before they got halfway.

[Andrew, Redditch 10 Dec 2006 21:28:38]

Lianna,

The veil is a "mark of separation", part of the uniform for those who want to distance themselves from Western culture, and for those who wish to relegate women to second class citizens. Describing yourself as "British-Muslim" (as many Muslims do) is another "mark of separation", it suggests thay you are Muslim first and British second.

You say the majority of "English" do not want to integrate, but this can not be simply dismissed as racism on the part of the indigenous population. The blame for much of the division must be with the Muslims. Islam is incompatable with modern Western democracy. It is unbendable and remains rooted in the past. It is Muslims who need to do more to integrate. We have all seen the Muslims marching in our streets calling for our destruction with little or no condemnation from so called "moderate" Muslims.

Much of sharia law is a disgusting breach of human rights, it belongs in the dark ages, yet Muslims support it and campaign for its introduction in this country. It didn't "work years ago". The British have never taken kindly to religious zealots of any persuasion. We do not like religion infringing on our freedoms. The British do not like being pushed around, even by God.

You say that you had no problem "fitting in" in the past but this is mainly due to British tolerance to (or ignorance of) a small unobtrusive minority, not because of the efforts of Muslims. Now that minority has grown sharply and the differences have become more apparent.

[Etzel Pangloss, Loughborough 10 Dec 2006 18:56:52]

Tony Blair has faith, how foreign.

[Mike Brundle-Derby 10 Dec 2006 18:41:24]

What is this? I found myself for once agreeing with what Our Prime Minister was saying. But hang on!. He should have been saying all of this years ago. Too late now Prime Minister. The dye has been set. Any semblance of respect for our hard fought traditions has disappeared, probably for ever. We are experiencing a steady erosion of all the things that this country of our stands for. No need to list them all.

Those of us who now have to face up to the harm being done to all that we treasured, quite frankly feel sick at the everyday attacks on our institutions and the freedoms that we have taken for granted. Is there no one to turn to, who will speak up for the silent majority? Far too late Prime Minister. You had the means to control the fast failing situation many years ago and did nothing. No good preaching tolerance now. The door has shut. There is nobody listening to you!

[mary.london 10 Dec 2006 16:15:44]

The pandering goes on, £350,000 globetrotting tour intended to improve "image of British Muslims" around the world. "However, some trips have backfired, participants using them as a platform to criticise Britain and it's goverment" (www.telegraph.co.uk).

[Sue. Derbyshire 10 Dec 2006 16:02:15]

We spend too much time doing down our own people for the sake of people who come here and do not conform. If they do not want to abide by our rules and our laws then why come?

[unbelievable 10 Dec 2006 10:41:31]

I am angered by the fact that everyone thinks immigration is easy into this country. Well, that is to say if you apply through British High Commission's abroad. My husband's visa was rejected because even though we are married, apparently we don't intend to live together. I spoke to my MP to be told even though I am pregnant with our first child I have no rights as a British citizen; nice.

This government spends millions of pounds on court cases etc for a select group of people who have no intention of integrating within Britsh society; some of which even refuse to speak English and acknowledge our laws. My family has been born and lived in this country for centuries. And yet, you have to be from certain areas of the world and have certain "religious beliefs" to have any rights in this country.

Ordinary citizens like myself have no human rights to family life. Maybe I should change my religion and then I too can scream about my rights, that appears to be how the system works.

[Eleanor, Surrey 9 Dec 2006 17:34:24]

The government have done nothing but pander to a certain minority in this country. When the extremists demonstrated in london in February this year with placards showing, Europe you will pay your 9/11 is on its way, freedom go to hell, behead those who insult islam! This was an incitement to murder and it shows that the police and government have one law for one group and another for the rest of us.

It is about time that Tony Blair finally voices concerns about the lack of integration from one element of our society. Perhaps if the P C brigade had not been allowed to get there own way the Country would not be in this mess.

As a woman I find the full veil deeply offensive and oppressive of women. The veil does not represent western values and we should ban it. How can you integrate when you cannot see there faces?

I hope now the government will actually start to listen to the majority of this country. Please please continue to voice our concerns Tony Blair!

[truth 9 Dec 2006 11:50:45]

The British 'politically correct' people should stop knocking our Brave Troops in countries that they are only trying to help. These troops are bravely fighting every day, and paying the cost with their courageous blood. They help the people of that country get the things that we have hospitals, schools and education.

Our thoughts should be with them and heap praise upon them, for they are the truly courageous.

[truth 9 Dec 2006 11:38:44]

Right on. At last the Prime Minister mr Blair has done what he should have done when he came to power. Let's hope for our wonderful country that our brave for-fathers, and the brave men our fighting for now, is not to late.

Wshould of had what the Yanks have always had; pledge allegiance to the flag and country first and abide by its democratic constitution and laws!! And stick to them or will not be allowed to enter!

Isn't that common sense? When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

[Karl, Lancs, UK 9 Dec 2006 10:37:59]

Too little, too late Mr Bliar. This Labour government have spent the last nine years creating this "multicultural" hell that clearly isn't working. Teflon's legacy has been one of unmitigated disaster. Iraq, law and order, multiculturalism, tax, personal debt, spin (lies). Has he anything whatsoever to be proud of?

The electorate will have to wait with patience to see the back of this sorry government. Unfortunately, 'hug a hoodie' seems to be a clone. Hopefully the rest of the Tory party will be able to reign in Cameron's silly liberal socialist dogma before he repeats Bliar's failed policies.

[Paul - London 9 Dec 2006 09:28:29]

I can't believe that a lot of sensible and decent people have got sucked into this unnecessary hype about Christmas Celebrations, This is a sick joke, by some sadistic individuals who are seeking publicity at the expense of the rest of us and also stirring up the emotions of hatred against each other.

I challenge the said Companies and Councils, to name even one individual of any persuasion that has raised an objection against the festivities of Christmas.

Every migrant community in Britain joins in the spirit of Christmas and the festive atmosphere, a lot of the ethnic community's children celebrate Christmas at schools, they also do it in the home, I have seen them putting up XMAS trees and lights with the same enthusiasm as any Christian child would, they wait for Santa in anticipation and rush down to open their presents on Christmas Day, all families get together just like the Christians do, people also join in at work, the office or works Christmas Parties and Lunches/Dinners are passionately enjoyed.

So who on earth started this pathetic, inhumane and despicable chain of events to stir up hatred amongst people at such an auspicious time of the year. To me this is a deliberate and calculated act of SABOTAGE and those responsible should be charged for inciting racial hatred or some sort of Public Order Offences or even both.

SO PLEASE, OPEN YOUR EYES AND SEE, DO YOU REALLY SEE ANYONE IN THE ETHNIC COMMUNITY NOT ENJOYING THE CHRISTMAS SPIRIT AND OBJECTING TO IT, I DON’T THINK SO.

MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ONE AND ALL, MAY PEACE BE WITH YOU.

[Simon, Frankfurt, Germany 9 Dec 2006 09:10:33]

Blair's comments come 30 years too late. I will be returning to London for Christmas but am now (as a white born Englishman who can trace his ancestry back 500 years) in an ethnic minority in my own Capital city. The UK is overrun with people who espouse a different cultures, won't integrate, refuse to learn English, dress & act as if they are still living in the Asian sub-continent.

Well done Messrs Blair, Major, Thatcher, Callaghan, Douglas-Home, Macmillan & Eden. You have effectively destroyed my country.

[DENNIS HERTS 9 Dec 2006 08:25:05]

Before Mr Blair and others air their views on multicultural society I suggest they spend a couple of months living in one of the areas where immigrants and other ethnics have taken over. He would see how everything British has just disappeared down the pan. It is very easy for people who live in nice leafy places a far cry from the real world, to blab on about how we should all get along.

Let him see how people who have lived in this country for generations have had everything given away to this so called multicultural society. Bring your burka Tony, without it you have no chance on the housing list, poverty could not beat us, the Blitz could not beat us, the closure of the docks could not beat us, but the never ending flood and so called Multicutural Society has beaten us. There is no way back, 2 minutes silence for all that was British.

[Faisal, Manchester 9 Dec 2006 06:40:31]

What is Integration? As a Muslim, does it mean I should go with my Christian friends and join them in the pub and converse over a pint? Does it mean I should go and join them for Sunday mass? If this is what integration means, then no I don't integrate. There are some values and beliefs which I will not give up. If integration means going about the British way of life, respecting other peoples values and cultures, obiding the rule of law and at the same time maintaining my religious identity, then yes, I integrate. Cultural identities are easier to give up than religious ones and this generally happens with anyone who comes to live in this country.

Living in the UAE, which is seen as a cultural melting pot, where you see people from every corner of the globe, I remember seeing white British families generally living in the same area, socialising mainly with fellow Brits and making absolutely no effort to learn Arabic, the local language.

It is natural for a certain cultural or religious group to stick together and live in the same area. This is the same with the Jews, Hindus as well as the Muslims in this country. But as usual it is always finding a way of having a pop at the Muslims. The more Islamophobic this country becomes, the more it will be seen that community relations breakdown, the more likely the notion of Multiculturalism will not work.

The situation is not bad at the moment, but if it does get bad, then as proud as a Briton I am, it will leave me no alterative but to leave Britain and find a safe haven elsewhere. I dearly hope that it does not come to that.

[Carlos Cortiglia 9 Dec 2006 05:44:33]

I would like to know what kind of integration Mr. Blair is talking about? Is is religious integration? Is it racial integration? Is it economic integration? Is it politicial integration? What are we talking about? We live in a society made up of ghettos and this is defined as Multiculturalism. History teaches us that this kind of arrangement does not work and can have disasterous consequences. Do we want Britain to become another Yugoslavia?

[mary.london 9 Dec 2006 03:27:13]

John Howard cares about his country and it's people. Sadly our Prime Minister doesn't.

[Lesley Romford Essex 9 Dec 2006 01:17:08]

If you every doubted Tony Blair, then today you should realise what a very brave man he is. With all the controversy surrounding Iraq, it would have been much easier for him to have never addressed this issue, but he is an honest and truthful man and today he has spoken for 99 3/4% of the British public. By this I include all other ethnic minorities to include Afro Carribean/ Chinese/ Nigerian/ Russian/ Polish/ Romanian/ Kosovan/ Buddist/ Sikh/ Hindu/ and many more.

All have integrated so well - but where is the problem? It is not cultural differences it is religious differences. If you watch the TV you will never see any of the above ethnic minorities mentioned - they are all very happy living here, integrating, contributing to our society, devastated at 9/11 and the Tube atrocities. They are with us - not against us.

A Moderate Moslem, show me one - where? Watch TV - bring on the moderate Moslem, they will still turn around the current problems to be Iraq, Palestine, and these are the moderates, what chance do we have with the fanatics? It is scary! However, we are a democratic society and we trust that our politicians - ha ha - will deal with this problem on our behalf.

[The Morning Post Sri Lanka 9 Dec 2006 00:43:08]

You can be a Jew, Hindu, Sikh, Roman Catholic or Muslim, but if you live in Great Britian you are first and foremost British. Anyone who does not wish to be so cannot be called a 'British Citizen,' only a 'British passport holder of convenience'. Everyone coming to settle in this country should be made to swear allegience to Queen and country.

However in many cases it is not the immigrants themselves who cause the rows here. They did not demand the ban on Christians wearing crucifixes at British Airways, nor did they try to force halal meat onto Christian school children. Similarily they did not ban nativity scenes on Royal Mail postage stamps or the sale of Christmas cards depicting the birth of Christ in all Red Cross Society charity shops.

My many ethnic minority friends in the UK openly critized this madness as embarassingly condescending. These were the actions of the 'barmy army' of political correct morons, who have done more to harm race relations in the UK than any radical Muslim.

[Carol, Kent 8 Dec 2006 23:49:18]

Why does the 'racist' word always crop up everytime anyone questions the muticultural propaganda? I don't care what colour, ethnic origin or religion anyone is, if they are British they're British as simple as that. The problems arise when the British (of whatever ethnic origin) people have to do the adjusting and the paying.

Anyone coming to live here should be able to speak the language, that means a saving on signs in all languages in public buildings, children wouldn't be disadvantaged in school. They should also be able to support themselves with the absolute understanding that there would have to be a long period of taxpaying before there was any possibility of benefits, including free healthcare. That, surely is common sense.

Why are we so coy about (and those of a nervous disposition may look away) CHRISTMAS? It is Christmas, whether you are Jewish, Hindu or Muslim doesn't matter, it is Christmas! You don't have to celebrate it, buy a present or put a decoration anywhere near your ceiling it doesn't change the fact that it IS Christmas, so why do some people find it offensive, I'm not offended by Diwali or Rammadam.

[Eddie Macdonald - Wishaw 8 Dec 2006 23:46:06]

Regardless of what has gone before, one thing is sure it's never too late to change. So well done to Tony for AT LAST laying it on the line to these religious extremists. Let's hope he follows it up with solid actions.

[Margo in Derbyshire 8 Dec 2006 22:50:46]

Integrate or stay away - several years too late Tone. Why are you saying all this now? It beggers belief after all these years of ignoring your public, you've come out with all this! I now hear you mentioning the Polish people, and next it will be the Slovaks, because let me tell you Tone, after a year in Slovakia, I can tell you roughly how many are on their way, at least 50% of them, they can't wait.

I travelled back to the UK in September after a year in Slovakia, with a plane half full of young Slovaks, on their way to UK hoping they will find work, and KNOWING, if they don't find work, WE WILL KEEP THEM! HEY HO!

Your 'good intentions' Tone, are far, far, far, too late! We are 'up the creek!' and not a paddle in sight!

[Craig 8 Dec 2006 22:36:48]

Blair's speech was balanced, constuctive and reasonable not like many of the comments here I'm afraid. It seems that we are in bash Blair season yet again even when he is being perfectly sensible. These right wingers should continue their assault with pleasure as the decent majority will see the type of following that the Tories still enjoy. They have changed not a jot.

[JS, London 8 Dec 2006 22:25:06]

Who was Mr Blair talking to? Interviews shown on TV with Muslims following Mr Blair's 'Vision' suggest that they don't listen to a word he says anymore - and quite right too.

[John, Scotland 8 Dec 2006 22:09:18]

What? Multicultural integration? But I just want to go to space...

[Andrew , Redditch 8 Dec 2006 21:16:33]

Paul, London;

The points you make on multiculturism and immigration on this blog are very good. I agree with you entirely on these issues. I have never had a problem with any religion apart from Islam. I find it incompatable with Western (and indeed any other) culture. I would like to see it banned in this country.

However, the Labour government is bound and gagged by political correctness and human rights and will never implement effective controls on this issue. The Tories are simply scared of their own shadow. Our leaders need a kick up the backside, and this is why many people will vote BNP in protest.

[Luke. Leicester 8 Dec 2006 21:06:24]

I live in Leicester and feel that the minority communities do not do enough to interate into mainstream society. In my opinion they seem to keep themselves to themselves and do not talk to others of different cultures.

I feel the Veil is a mark of seperation, and this country should stand up for itself and ban it. If Muslims dont like it then they should leave this country and live somewhere where they are happy, this is a Christian country, like it or lump it.

[terry portishead 8 Dec 2006 20:27:01]

Blair's speech today confirms that he is in denial regarding the viability of multiculturalism in this country, only unlike the situation in Iraq it is too late to cut and run. The only way we can make things better is to detatch ourselves from the European civil rights laws, disregard the loony left and their silly political correctness and demand that all immigrants accept British rule of law. It is now time for the indigeonus population (who never asked for multicultralism) and the decent immigrants of this country to vote for a political party that would demand those criteria.

[Brian Penny Ashford 8 Dec 2006 20:21:41]

It seems at last that Blair is beginning to come to his senses. He doesn't go far enough though. He says if you don't like what you see about Britain don't come. He should add if you are already here and don't like it, then go back to where you or your ancestors came from.

[ns 8 Dec 2006 19:52:07]

The majority of the English people are not racist, they just don't want to lose their Christian country to all other religions. I feel offended that other cultures find the cross, St George's flag, Easter, Christmas etc, offensive.

In previous employment our management gave out hot cross buns at Easter, until one year when a Muslim person said that they found the cross on the bun offensive. The company then took away all the hot cross buns and provided us with chocolates!!!!!

I think that if any other culture finds anything offensive in England then they should go and live in the country where their religion is based. Whether they are born in England or not.

[Thomas Stovin 8 Dec 2006 19:48:44]

Of course immigrants should make it their business to integrate! They, or their ancestors have come here mainly as economic migrants/ refugees and as such, must be prepared to put any cultural or religious differences that conflict with those of their adopted country behind them and not play "cuckoo-in-the-nest".

[Roger, Fleetwood 8 Dec 2006 19:35:09]

Maybe I'd take Blair more seriously if he, his missus and other soft in the head numpties had not constantly devalued our nations' (including Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland) traditions and heritage over the years. Enough of this Winterval garbage and other PC crap that the Blairs and those, mainly socialist pea-brains, like them are in the vanguard of promoting.

We have an education system that does not want to highlight the falling standards of school leavers. We have a Home Office that largely ignores victims of crime and panders to lowlifes. Freeing murderers and rapists early even when concern is expressed that they are still dangerous.
We have a police force that is run by chief constables more concerned with toadying up to Blair with an eye on a possible MBE than protecting the public. How does an Anti-Blair t-shirt threaten the public?

We have budget cuts in the NHS that now mean training cuts for junior doctors. We have hard working people saving for years to get a mortgage whilst we throw money at illegal immigrants (albeit only a few, but even one is still too many) who are allowed thousands of pounds of taxpayers money as grants.

We have a leader who has belatedly realised the country has woken up to the mess he has made. Parties that criticise people in debt yet could not run their own funds properly. We are at the mercy of other countries, who have already shown they can abuse their power, for our energy supplies.

Khalid is very fond of using song titles in his posts so I'll join him, here's one for you and your like Anthony. "You Fool No One" by Deep Purple.

[Alan Barclay Glasgow Scotland 8 Dec 2006 19:31:47]

What's taken Blair so long to make the statement he did today regarding Integration in this country? Indians, Chinese, Poles etc live here and get on with it, the only people who constantly complain are Muslims, and as one Tory MP said last year "if these young Muslims don't like the way Britains being run, then go back to the country from where your parents came from and see how you get on". We have Immigrants from Pakistan/Bangladesh who've been here for years and still won't learn to speak the Queen's English.

Multiculturalism has failed miserably in this country and as for the do-gooder lot out there as well as the PC brigade I say stuff the lot of them. Let us Britons fly our flags and keep our Christian heritage.
God save the Queen.

[Neil, London 8 Dec 2006 19:07:13]

Well I don't know what planet Tony Blair has been on all these years but it certainly hasn't been this one. It seems that he has only just woken up to what mainstream public opinion has always known. I don't think we ever wanted multiculturism as such, but do want our majority culture to hold sway just as all indigenous populations around the world obviously do.

I'm sure most of us only want people to come here who are going to see themselves as loyal British citizens who will respect our legal and democratic processes and our culture. Nobody expects immigrants to abandon every vestige of their culture and accept ours totally, although I think it entirely reasonable for them to make adjustments in order to be accepted by the majority.

Quite frankly, Labour has turned us into a laughing stock around the world with its daft PC ideas, and we probably need to call a halt to any further immigration while we sort out the mess that Tone has led us into. By letting so many immigrants into this country and by continuing to do so; Labour under Blair have made integration difficult to achieve and aroused tremendous resentment, especially in areas where there is already housing shortages and high unemployment. Immigrants must be made aware of their responsibilities and numbers must be strictly limited and properly managed for integration to occur otherwise the indigenous population will react the way they have.

[Dee 8 Dec 2006 18:49:42]

Even our beloved Queen has to follow foreign rules and traditions when she goes abroad, so why shouldn't they follow our rules and traditions when they decide to live here? The PC brigade are causing most of the problems.

[Pat from Leigh on sea 8 Dec 2006 18:49:16]

Coming from a man who has allowed our country to become a laughing stock around the World, why didn't he say this 9 yrs ago? He knows this country is doomed, thanks to him and his PC brigade, British people have no say in anything. Now he's realising that if he says the things that we want to hear, we might like him a bit more.

Disgraceful, Mr Blair. Your country has needed these words for a long long time but you were too busy letting ANYBODY in. You've not a clue how many people have come here illegally, and yet your lot turned a blind eye till it was too late.

[Peter, Fife 8 Dec 2006 18:32:30]

A little late, even so still welcome.

"...Our tolerance is part of what makes Britain, Britain. So conform to it, or don't come here. We don't want the hate-mongers, whatever their race, religion or creed..."
Tony Blair

[Chris - Woodbridge 8 Dec 2006 17:56:02]

I always remember Blair saying in 1997 that he wanted to create a modern multicultural society in Britain; that's probabaly why over the past ten years he has thrown the doors to open immigration. It will prove the most disasterous social experiment in our history for which he had no right to promote such a policy. Iraq, where I lived for five years, the Balkans, Kashmir, Chechenya, etc, are all examples of modern mulitural societies, full of ethnic and religious and ethnic conflict.

Twenty five years working in various parts of the world teaches you that there is no such thing as multicultural soeities. There are only societies divided along racial, ethnic and religious lines with the tensions always ready to come to the surface. Britain is no different, its society is dividing along the same lines and its no longer a question of white rascism. There is as much rascism in our ethnic communities as any where else and the recent riots in Birmingham between Asians and West Indians are only a portent of the future. Its an established fact that we now have white flight from our inner cities.

You will never create Blair's socialist vision. He lives in an ivory tower, not on the streets. People all over the world move towards and live with those that they have common religious, social or ethnic backgronds. Baghdad is a classic example, its a city generally split along its different ethnic/religious lines and now you can see the consequnces, virtual civil war. The consequences of Blair's stupid policies over the past 10 years will probably prove just as dire in the future. A downturn in the economy and high employment will probably be the catalylist for massive social problems arising from multiculturalism in the future.

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 8 Dec 2006 17:55:45]

LIANA:-

What would you and other Muslims do if Islam was banned in Britain?

[effie 8 Dec 2006 17:53:11]

Dora London:

I agree with most of all you say. Unfortunately while most Islamic people will and do want to integrate, there is a minority who will never live in peace with people of different denominations. They want to turn us into an Islamic State with Sharia law.

One cannot reason with these people, just look at the offence they took over Jack Straw, who asked them politely to remove the veil, but did NOT insist they remove it, if they felt any discomfort what-so-ever while doing so.

Think of how Dr Reid was shouted down when he went to listen the differing opinions held by the Islamic people and to discuss Islamic fears and opinion. Only those who shouted hardest were heard. The rest just stood like mutes and did not argue back.

It always end up with the peaceful majority being tarred by the same brush as the loud mouthed minority and until the Islamic people themselves stand up to be counted, integration will never happen.
All other religions live in peace here with the indigenous Christians.
Why can't they?

[payne UK 8 Dec 2006 17:48:20]

Blair and Bush are responsible for the radicalisation of some Muslims, through their policies in the Middle East. When Muslims see other Muslims being butchered it isn't surprising that younger Muslims especially rile against the injustice. Nothing is said about the Israeli atrocities against the Palistinians, if one says anything you get branded anti-semetic if daring to speak out for some balance.

What is happening in the Muslim world is relevent to how our own Muslims act at a home; to deny our foreign policy has no bearing on the Islamic world is utter nonsense. In no way do I support what happened nine/eleven or seven/seven, but one cannot bury the head in the sand like Bush And Blair. The British didn't practice what they are preaching now when they occupied India etc.

Most of the furore over Christmas decorations etcetra is not being pushed by the Muslims but by this Government and it's allies in the right wing press. I have Muslim friends and they couldn't care less how others celebrate Christmas or anything else for that matter, to blame them for the state of relations between faiths is using the Islamic Faith as scapegoats.

[Hacked off Perth 8 Dec 2006 17:27:43]

Liana, I think your equation is a wee bit mixed up; Integrate and racism will reduce!!!! It is the LACK of will to integrate by some elements that fuels racism.

[SHAN--Birmingham 8 Dec 2006 17:21:15]

I personally feel that people in the country are already integrated in a way as anyone working or owning businesses or driving pays their dues like everyone else.

In regard to people being tested for English as a medium of language when obtaining British citizenship - I am all for it. Integration is a two way street when it comes to the level of friends and personel relationships.

The current debate about immigrants has been brought about by the influx of asylum seekers, has anyone for a second paused and thought why is it that the majority of asylum seekers are from countries were we have interfered?

[Maurice - Northumberland - Former UK 8 Dec 2006 17:07:26]

1 - A Multicultural Country is a none starter. It was always doomed to failure, and why should the host population have to make any effort to accommodate them?

2 - To include Muslims/Islam into the mix is also a none starter. Due to the fact that the infidel and their ways are aborant to them, and none are British and nor can they be, they are part of the Ummah which excludes any National allegiances.

So very sadly the Words of Mr. Anthony Blair has come into being "We will change Britain forever". The fact that it is an absolute and predictable mess means nothing to them. How many Brits have already packed their bags and got out over the last 10 years? How many are planning their Exit?

Answer those two questions and you have what this Labour Government have really achieved!
The reality will have to be faced, no more Politically Correct pussy footing around - let all have their say!
As for D. Johnson/Staffs - I hope to be out before you - good luck on your choice!
Tony made the bed - not all of us are prepared to lay in it!

[T. England 8 Dec 2006 17:03:45]

This multicultural life is a front for imposing the new rules Britain will HAVE to follow! So what do I think this multicultural life really means?
It means that Britain is going to be a multi-FAITH society because the many religions that want a piece of Britain say so. I’m afraid that if it is true that multicultural means multi-faith then like the whole of history there is going to be big trouble.

Religion has never done anything but cause trouble & wars (like we don’t know that) so does Mr B really think he can impose his view on how faiths should get along & we all just will. Mr B is as deluded as the religious lot, OH! Hang on he is a religious man isn’t he? That says it all.
I’ll tell you what Mr B; you impose a secular life on the religious lot & me & my kind will make some allowances in letting the multitude of faiths that want a piece of this island have a corner to share.

Many good points Kev of Chester, I have no problem with integration but multi-culturalism results in individual groups forming.

I work for a Government body and we are FORCED to attend Diversity training or our work evaluations are affected even though I'm not racist and have a diverse